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Types of nutrient deficiencies and its symptoms??

Discussion in 'Water Chemistry' started by Veerall, Oct 21, 2015.

  1. scottward

    scottward New Member

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    Yep - I think that hits the nail right on the head.

    I think Solcielo is "sour grapes" because he was unsuccessful previously and is looking to blame something......
     

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  2. scottward

    scottward New Member

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    Without a shred of evidence? Like a lot of other things in life, it's mostly the negative stuff that is in your face the most. So quite a lot of forums on the Internet about, just about any topic really, are mainly about things going wrong/not working etc. For other hobbies of mine, I asked a lot of questions etc when things weren't working out, but, once I got the hang of it, I've quietly gone off and keep to myself. Same with this hobby.

    When you "identify trace toxicity in their plants" - how do you know the plants aren't being carbon starved? So you reduce the trace dosing and things improve? Perhaps this is because the plants are no longer limited by carbon but are now limited by a micro nutrient instead? The micro nutrient limitation might manifest in a less "melodramatic" (can't think of a better word) way than a carbon limitation....

    If you end up nutrient limiting your plants in your low CO2 + high light setup it will be interesting to see how your tank pans out over several months. Your tank is very immature still. I would photo journal it (e.g. take a weekly photo and detail what your dosing/settings are) etc.

    You say "nothing I say or do would convince you and there really is no point".

    If you were in arms reach I'd strangle you. :) :) :)

    Do this. Photo Journal.

    This is getting tiring.
     
    ShadowMac likes this.
  3. Icethunder

    Icethunder Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I agree with you
     
  4. Icethunder

    Icethunder Aspiring Aquascaper

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    This law also applies to CO2, which is much more complicated than dosing scheme, but many simply its shortcomings attributed to other things.
     
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  5. ShadowMac

    ShadowMac Moderator Staff Member

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    Just for fun...if I wanted to provide evidence of trace nutrient toxicity at EI dosing levels here is what I would do.

    I would begin with a literature review. I would look for academic papers describing micronutrient toxicity in plants and for papers that describe or propose biochemical mechanism for the damage done by toxicity. This would help support observations being interpreted as toxicity. I would carefully cite those in my introduction and discussion.

    I would setup a control tank and an experimental tank with identical equipment. I would write out specifically everything involved in the setup of the tanks. I would then choose one plant, something that grows easily like myrio, hornwort, or wisteria. I would then provide a baseline growth time that is well defined, say two to three weeks. I would then provide detailed observations and photographs. Growth rates would be measured at fixed intervals ie 2 cm from day 1 to day 3 and maybe number of new leaves or nodes. After establishing a baseline period I would enter the experimental phase. I would dose EI to the experimental tank and continue with detailed photos, measurements, and descriptions of my observations over a defined period of time say 3-4 weeks. I would carefully describe the dosing routine used and how I was estimating the ppm or mg/l concentration of CSM +B. To improve the power of this simple study design multiple controls and experimental tanks could be used. Replication is important so it would also be important to run it a few times. To better eliminate bias you could also provide randomized controls by creating a blind. Someone else could dose the tanks and you have them numbered. You only know them as tank 1,2,3,4...etc. Whereas the person dosing and not making records of observations knows which ones are getting CSM+B and which are not. I think this would be an important step for you. At the conclusion you could also take a dry weight of the plant mass. This is something done often in growth experiments for aquatic macrophytes.

    Step 1) carefully define and describe your hypothesis. It would be specific ie EI dosing level of CSM + B causes (insert very specific item like leaf damage or growth stunting, etc). You would then need to define EI dosing levels and ranges.
    Step 2)find research in the scientific literature to support proposed hypothesis. Forum threads DO NOT COUNT.
    Step 3) run the well controlled experiment and make detailed records of the findings. In detail describe how the experiment is run.
    Step 4) write up a findings and discussion section, reference literature that supports your interpretations of the findings and propose further work.
    Step 5) submit to experts and peers for review and critique

    There, hope this helps turn mud into pudding.
     
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