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IAPLC 2012 grading detail is out

Discussion in 'News Around the World' started by Shadow, Nov 30, 2011.

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  1. severumkid

    severumkid Aspiring Aquascaper

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    hmmm...I wonder why are we discussing all this, now that my bitterness have eroded a bit and I am returning to my senses. what are we gaining out of it? I am not asking, not to, I am just trying to understand where we are heading.

    Will all this bring in any change to the outlook of IAPLC participants? Will there be any amendment in the contest rules to prevent all this trickery?
    Or,
    will this circus run year after year and we will strive harder and eagerly participate and then more eagerly wait for the results and then shout from the nearest and tallest rooftop about discrimination, injustice, trickery, photo shop etc etc.

    If later is teh case then I see no reason to pursue this thread anymore.
     

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  2. biobio

    biobio Aspiring Aquascaper

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    It's sad, sad, sad...
    Not only that someone has not done something by the book. The sad thing is that we are wasting so much time arguing about it instead to discuss nice things shown in TOP200.
    In the last few days, at various international forums, more than 10 aquariums has been placed under suspicion. Number is growing.
    No one wants to discus fresh ideas, new aquascaping techniques applied, artistic impression, the beauty that is shown in TOP200 – Everywhere and everyone is writing only about fraud, violation of the rules, deception, PS, ....
    Sad, sad, sad,....

    Even before I was not disappointed that my tank was not included in the TOP200. Now I am more than happy about it. I am happy, too that I decided to send a photo directly from camera (even without cropping). The thought that someone could put my aquarium in this sort of topic and discuss it as a fraud and deception terrifies me. After so much effort and love that I put in it.

    All this is sad and ugly: fraudsters, cheaters, silent organizing committee, pointing finger at someone's work, things that we are wasting our time on, negative energy that prevails, ...
    I feel bitterness in my throat and stomach cramps.

    If someone wants to discuss the beautiful and innovative things in TOP200 please open a new threat. I will be more than happy to take part in it.
     
  3. youjettisonme

    youjettisonme Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I should be clear that I didn't have you in mind when I wrote the last post. I think you experienced something completely normal... disappointment. Maybe I would have written almost the same post had I not placed in the finals. I'm capable of losing perspective just like everyone else.
     
  4. youjettisonme

    youjettisonme Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I am with you on this. It is quite a shame. The complaints are absolutely genuine. I am really glad to hear, as well, that you took your pic, uncropped, from camera to upload, just as I did. I also feel bad for those that likely finished just out of the top 200 because of a handful of malcontents.
     
  5. severumkid

    severumkid Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Since we are at it, we may go a little more deep into our sorrow.

    This particular tank, is a doubtful case once again. So I want to clear my doubt. If it is not any kind of trickery then I am apologising to the owner in t he beginning only. Sorry, this is the trust level this IAPLC have left me with. :sick:

    [​IMG]

    Please check the white line behind the left tree. Is this the Co2 tubing? Does not look like that. Next the fishes also look very interesting. Plus the Eriocaulons. I want your opinion on this.
     
  6. youjettisonme

    youjettisonme Aspiring Aquascaper

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    As someone who has been using Photoshop for about 15 years as past of my design business, I am still not speaking as "an expert", but I will say that minus a larger image, this one looks inconclusive. I guess you would have to ask yourself, in the case of the white line, what did they have to gain? What part might they have photoshopped in to improve the scape? And if they were able to improve the scape by shopping it, how are they simultaneously too incompetent to then remove the white line in question which looks awful? With the eriocaulons, what are you seeing? I can't tell by just looking at the small rez pic.
     
  7. Aquadream

    Aquadream Aspiring Aquascaper

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    From this picture I can not conclude about the fish much, but the white line behind the left tree is caused by the fact that the tank is not with a strict rectangular shape. That line comes from cut off section on the left back corner. One more glue line. Look at the water surface line for that.

    If someone is competent enough to grow this mosses this well I can asure you they wouln't need to Photoshop anything.
     
  8. Aquadream

    Aquadream Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Look man really. Cut the chase off. Don't you understand that it is up to IAPLC steering commetee and Amano which pictures get in and which not?

    IT IS THEIR CONTEST. COMPANY ENDEVOR WITH COMPANY MONEY IN IT.

    It is not up to you, luis, Victor me or anybody here to decide anything other than enter or not.

    If anybody enter it's their choise.

    The rules this, the rules that. I stop this moan long ago, because it is useless and gains nothing.

    On the other hand I have organised the International Balkan Aquascaping Contest IBAC 2011 and IBAC 2012.

    On that contest there is no cheating of any kind, because I as administrator would not allow it. Simple as that. But in there it is up to me. Not up to ADA and Amano.

    So if anyone wants to participate in fair, with tight rules contest and wants to HAVE FUN all are wellcome.

    All results, grading points and comments from each judge will be published for anyone to see.

    Also the sponsorship is relatively poor. So there will be very small symbolic awards. Let see now how many of you that stated their aquascaping to be just for hobby and for fun, are going to join our contest.

    No glory, no money, no business, only hobby and fun.
     
  9. abhradip1986

    abhradip1986 Aspiring Aquascaper

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    well in that case count me in! As if you really want to know from the stand point of the prize if I even by chance win..I personally want you to invest that money for a bigger - better competition next year! For me the rank or fame does not matter, as neither I would do it for the money nor do I aquascape professionally it's my hobby but showcasing my work at international level is what I look forward to. I know I am no great scapist but I would rather do it for fun than with some beneficiary purpose!!
     
    Aquadream likes this.
  10. viktorlantos

    viktorlantos Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I think there's no problem pointing out things with these tanks. There are many others where we can't point out anything.
    It's not good that a topic is fully about criticizm and other stuff but this is also part of the contest as we see. These kind of feedback may help to the organizers to watch out for things in the future, but i am not optimist on that. I would welcome a much better rule system by the way. The problem is not when somebody enter with more tanks, the problem is when there is something wrong with the tank itself.

    changing the discussion a bit i am glad that i've seen a few tank which again stretched the boundaries on can dos. which is very good.
    how about the floating seiryus? or the savanna scape? many good ones there. i look forward to see the top 100.
     
  11. Aquadream

    Aquadream Aspiring Aquascaper

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    All sensible said in here. Only wish to point out that what ever critics are made they better be according to the IAPLC rules, not according to what the rules should be or how would have been more fair or moral etc.
    Because it is ADA contest and they are the judges of all in there and no one is forced to enter.

    So when we talk about IAPLC wrong with the tank means one thing, in case of UKAPS wrong would mean something else, in the IBAC contest wrong is even more different definition.

    All because those contests have different rules of entry, rules that all should respect, not compare.

    Everything comes down to a different point of view. And that difference does not make one right and another wrong.
     
  12. youjettisonme

    youjettisonme Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Since we are back on this topic, I may as well contribute to it. From my personal experience, this is what's wrong with IAPLC:

    1) The rules, although stated on the website, leave too much room for interpretation. It needs to be laid out in a way that is more clear to all participants.
    2) The one person, one entry rule is unneccesary and unenforcable. I am sure that plenty of you entered multiple tanks, and that's great for you, but it penalizes naive people like me who, when he read "submit only one tank or else get disqualified" submitted only one tank. Again, it's a nonenforceable, quixotic rule so it's not difficult to see why anyone would choose to break it.
    3) The contest needs a Participant Vetting Process and not a "Participants Get a Vote" process. In a Participant Vetting Process, the final 200 would get announced, and then protests may be lodged from fellow participants to the steering committee for a period of 2 weeks. After the steering committee has read through all the complaints (and there will always be plenty of complaints), they can pick out the most egregious violations and disqualify those entries and those participants. This ends up making it much more fair for all participants.

    Finally, I am sorry that this thread, and likewise, this contest has caused so many folks so much unneeded frustration. I will always contend that if we all met each other in real life for an adult beverage, the little misunderstandings that take place here would never happen. No one can read a person's intent, nor their full meaning just by reading their words on the internet.
     
    Jurijs mit JS and Aquadream like this.
  13. Ed Villagracia

    Ed Villagracia Active Aquascaper

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    ONCE AGAIN, this particular thread is open for everyone to express their own personal views and opinion regarding IAPLC2012 and is fun reading.............guys, just make a healthy conversation brothers;)
     
    Shadow likes this.
  14. Shadow

    Shadow Moderator Staff Member

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    Yup fun reading :ROFLMAO: as long as is not start scolding other member :(
     
  15. Button

    Button New Member

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    As regarding the Cardinal tetras at this picture there are different species of the Cardinal tetra. So there is no cheat at all with the fishes. I've got three varies of species at one tank so I can confirm the one has red stripe along all the body are double bigger than one who has the red stripe only on a tail.
     
  16. viktorlantos

    viktorlantos Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Yup no offense.

    Switching the discussion a little. Flipping through on the top 200 again i feels like not all the tank is on the same quality level (since we also run a contest for years i have a bit of an experience on this how we review entrants, but i know this much of entries is a whole different story).
    maybe this is because the way they scan/view the images or the different judges from all over the world cause this. not sure.
    Or maybe they just wanted so many different type of layout that some tanks qualified because it's shows a different layout than most.

    Maybe i am alone with my feeling. Maybe it was better when we only seen the top 27 and this is just a new thing that we see more of them before the winner announcement.

    IAPLC for me is the World Championship every year. There are many great contests, but this one gave the most inspirational pieces for us in the past years. The winners here usually helped many other contests too to provide quality entrants and with this they raised the levels there too.

    But sometimes trends or new things makes me think that we may on the wrong way. This year the quality level on some tanks, the (painted etc) background elements, photoshop things was the one which i do not like and for me these things hurt the contest in some way.

    How you guys feel?
    Seeing the top 200 ahead is good or bad? In overall you feel the same wow effect like in the past years? Did this move to involve the voting was a good decision?

    Edit: quality level for me means healthy plants in overall and good standing with the scroring rules. so it's not my personal taste. it is the tank vs the scoring.
     
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  17. Aquadream

    Aquadream Aspiring Aquascaper

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    These things are an indicator of one's luck of creative ideas, but present desire to shine. I also find it cheap to put posters behind aquariums to enhance the final picture. About heavy PS manipulations, that's plain ugly.
    I think seeng the top 200 is good. I would also say the wow efect is greater. After all seeing 200 layouts at once is impressive.
    Involving the public voting I would say is a good idea, because it gives at least to the partisipants some say in the matter. The say that so many crave for.
    However the public say will also degrade the quality of the outcome result, because great many will vote on a regional-buddy principal, not on what is the best principal.[/quote]
    +1
     
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  18. ghostsword

    ghostsword Aspiring Aquascaper Staff Member

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    I actually like to see the top 200.. :) Yes, some are odd, but this is based on my taste, so it is nice to see different styles on show, it actually means that the different judges were at play and chose what mattered for them.

    I wholeheartedly agree with your comment about trends, a bit like fashion, however it does not mean we are on the wrong or right way, just a different way.

    Now with the entrants judging also we will see a better representation of what the aquascaping community like.

    For example, the tanks with painted backgrounds, without fish, what I call the "Turkish effect", are not for me, but then one or two are outstanding. There is a tank that look like it is a mountain range, and large, but it is only 15cm deep. That is inspirational.

    Even with the photoshop issues, and copies of last years themes, this is one of the best competitions, I doubt that anything in the world compares to it. :)
     
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  19. ghostsword

    ghostsword Aspiring Aquascaper Staff Member

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    This is the scape I am talking about, how amazing it is.. :
    [​IMG]
     
  20. ghostsword

    ghostsword Aspiring Aquascaper Staff Member

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    But this one, how is it done? Outstanding..

    [​IMG]
     
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