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70 Gallon "Woodagumi"

Discussion in 'Aquascaping Showcase' started by plantbrain, Nov 28, 2011.

  1. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Banner before the main bank of lights goes off.

    [​IMG]

    With just the two aquaflora bulbs

    [​IMG]
     

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  2. Blue_dolphin

    Blue_dolphin New Member

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    To much fishes, half amount should be better...
    Very impressive wood layout!
     
  3. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    This may come across rather harsh, it's not directed at you personally.

    Frankly, I do not care if anyone thinks it's too many fish. I am tired of seeing 70 Gallon aquariums with 10 fish in them. To many aquarist, that's too little/few fish. The bioload and the longevity on this stocking/planting is valid and can sustain for decades. So in that context, this tank is fine.
    For folks who enjoy ADA like idealized set ups, then sure. 10-20 little fish would be their aesthetic, it sure ain't mind. I want to see lots of nice schooling fish, not some contest picture in my tanks at home.

    It does not do it for me. My tanks are for the aquarist, not the planted hobbyists alone.

    I suppose if I spent less time with CO2, I'd have to add only a few fish, because I see many planted aquarist gas and kill their fish. They add lots of CO2, then add fish later......I rarely see aquariums/scapes/fish that last for 5 years or more. The goal I have is quite different.

    These fish where considered for the 120 Gal, and I might change them to that tank and move the Rainbows in here later. So the no# of fish will not seem much in that tank, in this one, due to the open design, they stand out, but.....that's the point.

    I've seen tanks where the # of fish is too many, but this is a 70 Gal tank with 85 samller 1-1.5" tetras, hardly a large bioload, the tank has a huge wet/dry filter and gets 60% water changes weekly. They get fed well also,: mysid shrimp, Bloodworms, Brine, Flake and any RCS culls I have, they rip any smaller shrimp to bits like their larger cousins: piranha.

    I'm very much a proponent of lower stocking levels and taking good care of livestock, not keeping larger massive species etc, but that's not the case here, at least for me.

    when aquarist over fill their tanks and do not/cannot take care of them...then lose fish often........that's just wrong.
     
  4. CatfishSoupFTW

    CatfishSoupFTW Aspiring Aquascaper

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    love it. i always struggle using HC. it was doing fine, until i stopped dosing co2. -_-
     
  5. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    It can be grown in non CO2, but the DSM is best to speed the process up much better.

    But if it's adapted to good CO2, and you mess with the CO2......well, then......trouble will start.

    This tank looks much better than it actually is ....at least to me. The rug is ratty and not dense like it should be due to the CO2 issue, I am very tempted to replant the sections, at say 1/4 of the tank each week and a water change each replanting etc.

    I'm not happy there.
    It's growing well now, but the lower parts are not thick as they should be.
    I could also mow really well and spend a long time doing that.
     
  6. randy0319

    randy0319 Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Dear plant brain,

    Good to see your tanks and much appreciate your advice. I totally agree with you about fish/bioload. As far as HCC is concerned, I did happen to see a pic of an ADA tank at Amono's place just after planting- fresh from the assistants hands. I saw whole clumps of HCC. None were broken up or divided. The assistant must have trimmed the wool and sunk the whole 'pot' of them. There were over 100 'pots' of HCC for the set up. I thought that I would try that so I bought twenty four pots of HCC for an Iwagumi (granite chrysanthemum) and planted them all. I had riccia in its place until they arrived and have yet to take pics of the HCC. So far so good. They have really taken off and seem to fill in miuch faster. I use black sand as a substrate. For what it is worth - you might try that approach. Your tanks are really great and it is good to read your journals and threads. Best wishes---R
     
  7. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I have enough to replant, I've used pots and trimmed them in the past also. I almost did the DSM, which is the similar, but takes longer, still HC is cheap by the pot or rug. I think they often do that to fill in the scape faster, vs letting it grow, but this is a $ trade off, but not really worth the difference in cost overall. Spend 1500$ to save 40$:-"

    I may redo the return also, I have better results with a different flow than these types in the past and the present.

    I'll use some modified loc line I think.

    My older larger scale HC rugs looked much better, so I will likely take this out a little at a time and allow the sections to regrow. Maybe 1/4 tank sections and then follow with a good water change each time.
     
  8. randy0319

    randy0319 Aspiring Aquascaper

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    How often do you do water changes and how much per time?
     
  9. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Weekly now, about 60%
     
  10. Fizgig777

    Fizgig777 New Member

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    I also like the big school of fish =)
     
  11. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Sold off most of the Erio and then transplanted the Type 3 giant Erio back to the 120, it seems okay even though the shrimp are all over it.

    I'll replant some sections and evaluate how they are doing tonight and tomorrow. Then give them 2 weeks to assess.

    Growth is rampant. But they needed to get a better start to keep the mat down better. Seems I made the mistake of timing the CO2 issue at the worse time for that.

    Significant Other is ribbing me for NOT using the DSM.
    It still looks good to most folks, but I'm picky about this detail.
     
  12. severumkid

    severumkid Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Too many fish kills the aesthetics of the presentation. Not to attack your thoughts, plant brain or any one for that matter, just MHO. I respect your idea, of stocking as long as you are happy.
     
  13. ghostsword

    ghostsword Aspiring Aquascaper Staff Member

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    Yep, it is a lot of fish, but it is also a large tank. :)

    The fish have way more space than when they were on a shop, and they are small enough to not create a large impact on the bioload.

    Must be nice to see the shoal move, he? Do a video if you can. :)
     
  14. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I do not think so, this is a bunch of BS feed via the contest and aesthetics on the FTS only, not a real tank.

    Who wants to see a tank with TOO MANY plants and not many fish?
    See? Now we are being fair.........

    This is EXACTLY what most fish keepers think of our aquariums.

    "Where's the fish? How come come you have hardly anything swimming around in there?" Too many plants and cannot see any fish.......

    :eek:

    It's easy to comment from the planted tank side with out any deference to the fish keeper. I started this hobby as a fish keeper, and I can defend such argument by artist snobbery. Tank and the scape still looks nice and there is a lot of action.

    Why do we need to reduce the fish?
    I mean not because someone ELSE says so...........but ask yourself the question, is it because of the ADA influence?

    Is it because many kill their fish with CO2?

    Is it because it requires more skill to keep both plants and fish on equal focus? Rather than placing plants as the primary goal and the fish.......an almost secondary after thought?

    I would say that in the top scapes over a few decades now.......I've seen, a very very small % consider fish to be of much importance, it's like adding sprinkles on your ice cream.

    Why settle?
    Why not have both?

    These are VERY basic questions.
    My philosophy is simple and modest: seek questions, not answers.

    Can you specifically answer what about this aesthetic is undesirable?
    In my 120 Gal, I have the same relative no of fish, you just cannot see them, people ask if I have fish in that tank, but say too many here?

    Bit of irony really.
     
  15. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    The tank is planted in such a way you can see the fish and they are not cryptic, they are out in the open.

    I'd planned to add them to the 120 Gal, where I'll be better able to see them, then add the Rainbows which hide more.......to this tank.

    The blue and reds will look nice in here.

    The problem is that I cannot catch the damn Rainbows:(
     
  16. StanChung

    StanChung Aspiring Aquascaper

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    LOL. Well in any jungle- there's more trees visible than animals.
    Only in battery farms you see more animals than grass.
    Howzat? Twitch twitch.... :)))
     
  17. StanChung

    StanChung Aspiring Aquascaper

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    ...and to be fair you call this tank a Woodagumi not Fishygami. :D
     
  18. ghostsword

    ghostsword Aspiring Aquascaper Staff Member

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    I have 7 tanks at home, and only on one of them has a large percentage of fish.

    Guess which one the kids, family and friends like most? :)

    The one with lots of fish, action in front of your eyes.

    Obviously too crowded for iaplc, but it is the favorite tank in the house. :)

    Still high tech, lots of co2 and ferts, water changes and a strict light regime.

    Comparing to a 50l I have with just 10 embers and lots of moss and ferns, which looks great aquascape wise, but nobody at home really spends time in front of it. Apart from me, of course.



    ___________________________
     
  19. StanChung

    StanChung Aspiring Aquascaper

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    I have to agree- Fishes & sometimes shrimp are stars of the tank. When I started a planted tank, it was because I wanted a nice environment for the fish.
    It hasn't changed- only difference is the environment is a bit more elaborate. :))
     
  20. plantbrain

    plantbrain Aspiring Aquascaper

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    Ah, but there is plenty of wood to be seen still:)
    And if your fish are sessile and stationary, you got bigger problems as an aquarist.
     

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